Sudden Weight Loss and T2
Question:
> I think it’s a low percentage (as well). Given the fact that it’s extremely > difficult for most people to lose weight in case of overweight/obesity, > that 33% is very high indeed. > Somewhere else in this thread Eldritch suggested a 90% overweight (at/after > diagnosis?) which sounds more real to me.
Yes, 90% is the figure I’ve heard, and 67% does seem low to me, but I can’t say I’m sure of the accuracy of the 90% figure. E
Response:
> That’s not to say that unexplained weight loss is only caused by > diabetes. There are other medical conditions which may do that as well. > If diabetes is involved they your friend should be plagued by > thirst and frequent urination. He would complain of being hungry most > of the time. He may have noticed he’s become suddenly more nearsighted. > And he would probably feel tired and sleepy a lot.
Unexplained weight loss and a family history of diabetes was what made me schedule a dr.’s appointment. I had ALL the symptoms you mentioned. But in retrospect, they seemed to come on rather quickly– that is, the time frame of me going from feeling ok to suspecting I had out of control diabetes took about 6 months. I’m about 30 lbs. overweight, but this weight loss (about 20 lbs. total) made my skin sag and took my muscle tone. My palms and soles were dry and felt like sandpaper. Two months into treatment, I seem to have found those 20 lbs! But I’m trying to get rid of them the right way now <g>. My glasses are working again, and I no longer have to carry around a bottle of water everywhere because I’m always thirsty. So yes, I agree with you that weight loss can be caused by a number of illnesses, but it’s the combination of that and the other symptoms that point strongly to diabetes. >Wal-Mart, Walgreens and a number of drugstores have > house brand meters that cost about $9.00 which might come with 5 or 10 > free test strips. Test strips would cost about $42 for 100 or less if > they sell a box of 50 strips.
I got the Walgreens meter when I was first diagnosed. I thought I was getting good control until I was able to get a (free) Freestyle meter. Boy, was I humbled, and not in a good way! The Walgreens meter consistently read 20-25 points below the Freestyle. I found that the Freestyle readings correlate more closely with my lab readings; it reads all the glucose in the sample, while the Walgreens meter requires a much larger sample and yields a less specific reading. 20 points can make a difference in how I plan my meals or time my meds. I know any meter is better than no meter. But if someone strongly suspects they have diabetes, they’re going to be testing quite regularly and they might as well get the best meter their budget or insurance provider will allow, rather than opting for a cheaper meter that might not be as sensitive. YMMV, JMHO, etc. etc… kaci Type 2 dx 4/29/03 Glucovance 5/500 2x, altace 10 mg, zocor 40 mg.
Response:
> Thanks for the good information. > My friend is under medical control and doing fine.
I’m glad to hear that. > …then in the last two month after I had a prostate operation. > This increased voiding quantity for a while and I lost about 4 lbs. This > doesn’t sound like much, but it was a concern to me because what I knew > about my friend.
It seems reasonable that the stress of the operation may have caused the weight loss. > Fortunately, the BG > remained very steady during the loss. This indicates that there was no major > change in my diabetes condition. I’ll wait till my yearly check-up in > August to find out.
Yes. What the meter reads is the important thing. Good luck. E
Response:
> I wonder if those figures were based on diagnosis weight. If not, > then part of the other 33% could have lost weight after diagnosis as > that’s what most docs advise.
I think it’s a low percentage (as well). Given the fact that it’s extremely difficult for most people to lose weight in case of overweight/obesity, that 33% is very high indeed. Somewhere else in this thread Eldritch suggested a 90% overweight (at/after diagnosis?) which sounds more real to me. — CeeBee
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Thanks for the information. I have one question: > Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making > very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the > blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The > cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though > glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the > kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and > passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is > literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed. >If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on the >BG meter as high readings? >Fred Henzi
yes. Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.
Response:
> An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is > the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m > concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though.
I was losing about a pound a day before diagnosis. Reason: peeing away 4000 calories per liter.
Response:
>>If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on > the >BG meter as high readings? > Yes. But if the diabetic is undiagnosed, it’s not likely he or she would > even have a meter.
True. When I wrote that, I mistakenly assumed the poster was asking about an undiagnosed friend. Since he was asking whether this would show up on a meter, I assumed he was thinking about obtaining a meter to check. On re-reading his post, I see his friend is already diagnosed. E
Response:
Thanks for the good information. My friend is under medical control and doing fine. I understand now better why sudden weight loss can be a sign of diabetes. I was concerned that my own diabetes changed because I lost weight lately. I am a skinny T2. I reached this stage in two phases, one three years ago after dx, and then in the last two month after I had a prostate operation. This increased voiding quantity for a while and I lost about 4 lbs. This doesn’t sound like much, but it was a concern to me because what I knew about my friend. I’m 140 lbs now and my height is 5-10. Fortunately, the BG remained very steady during the loss. This indicates that there was no major change in my diabetes condition. I’ll wait till my yearly check-up in August to find out. Fred Henzi
Response:
> Not all type 2’s are overweight. But you see that so often in the > media you tend to believe it. >From the top of my head: I once read US figures showing that from the > people with T2 67% was overweight and 46% was obese. (I guess these 46% are > included in the 67% definition). So roughly 2/3th is overweight or
obese. I wonder if those figures were based on diagnosis weight. If not, then part of the other 33% could have lost weight after diagnosis as that’s what most docs advise.
Response:
> Thanks for the information. I have one question: > Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making > very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the > blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The > cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though > glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the > kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and > passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is > literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed. > If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on the > BG meter as high readings?
Yes. But if the diabetic is undiagnosed, it’s not likely he or she would even have a meter. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/
Response:
It seems most people start to dump glucose in the urine at around 150. Years ago I sent a fellow to the doctor because of frequent bathroom trips. He had diabetes. In cases like mine, when I run low on insulin my body senses starvation and dumps out more glucose. Very high blood sugars. I have no natural insulin. People like me use long acting insulin to prevent this. I need about 0.7 units per hour to prevent this. The early stages of diabetes does not cause ’starvation" but the excess food input runs the blood sugars up since there is not enough insulin to handle the glucose you from you food.. Type 1’s where the onset is acute, the body will start to use the fat and protein to survive. This will cause rapid weight loss This the form of a Ketone condition that is dangerous. Type 1’s have to be aware of this. Guy I accept corrections or added info willingly. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks for the information. I have one question: > > Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making > > very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the > > blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The > > cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though > > glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the > > kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and > > passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is > > literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed. > If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on >the > BG meter as high readings? >Yes. But if the diabetic is undiagnosed, it’s not likely he or she would >even have a meter.
Response:
> Not all type 2’s are overweight. But you see that so often in the > media you tend to believe it.
From the top of my head: I once read US figures showing that from the people with T2 67% was overweight and 46% was obese. (I guess these 46% are included in the 67% definition). So roughly 2/3th is overweight or obese. Other risk groups are people with high cholesterol levels, high blood pressure, asthma those with poor overall health and there are even differences between ethnic groups. — CeeBee
Response:
> An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is > the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m > concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though.
I’m sorry. I got focused on your friend. After rereading your post, I see that he has already been diagnosed and your concern is about your own low weight. Being thin is not a risk factor for Type 2 diabetes. About 90% of Type 2’s are obese/overweight. Type 1 diabetics are usually thin, but it’s not caused by thiness. If you’re feeling fine then there is no problem. I posted diabetic symptoms in my last post. Urination, thirst etc. A sudden unexplained weight loss would be a sign that something amiss is going on, but if you’re low weight is stable then that’s probably not a problem. Some people have low set points and are just normally thin. E
Response:
> An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is > the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m > concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though.
Not all type 2’s are overweight. But you see that so often in the media you tend to believe it. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/
Response:
Thanks for the information. I have one question: > Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making > very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the > blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The > cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though > glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the > kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and > passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is > literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed.
If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on the BG meter as high readings? Fred Henzi
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Thanks for the information. I have one question: >Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making >very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the >blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The >cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though >glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the >kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and >passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is >literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed. > If the glucose level mounts higher and higher, wouldn’t this show up on the > BG meter as high readings?
Yes. It certainly would. Well controlled diabetics don’t like their BG levels above, say, 180. Very badly controlled diabetics talk about bgs in the 300-400 range. Undiagnosed/untreated diabetics who are losing weight because of this process can have bgs at 600 or more. Rarely, I’ve seen a post of a diabetic who was tested at around 1000. These are dangerously high levels and these people are normally put in the hospital so their bgs can be lowered quickly under medical supervision. People in this condition don’t feel good. They’re quite sick. That’s not to say that unexplained weight loss is only caused by diabetes. There are other medical conditions which may do that as well. If diabetes is involved they your friend should be plagued by thirst and frequent urination. He would complain of being hungry most of the time. He may have noticed he’s become suddenly more nearsighted. And he would probably feel tired and sleepy a lot. If you’re thinking of testing your friend, meters are easy to get. For your friend’s situation, the easiest way would be to borrow one from a diabetic friend. Perhaps the Education Department of your local hospital would have a meter available and be willing to do a quick test. Beyond that you can easily buy them at any drugstore (I’m assuming you’re in the US). Wal-Mart, Walgreens and a number of drugstores have house brand meters that cost about $9.00 which might come with 5 or 10 free test strips. Test strips would cost about $42 for 100 or less if they sell a box of 50 strips. E
Response:
>An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is >the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight.
No, all T2s aren’t overweight. I am, and was upon diagnosis. However, when I was asked at the ER how much I weighed, I gave them a figure 10lbs more than I actually weighed. Seems I had lost 10 lbs while eating everything I could get my hands on trying to kill that "starving" feeling. Bev Remove the "SpamFree" for email, please. Join us in the Diabetic-Talk Chatroom on UnderNet /server irc.undernet.org — /join #Diabetic-Talk More info: http://www.diabetic-talk.org/
Response:
>An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is >the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m >concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though. >Fred Henzi >67, T2 , dx’d 00, 5-10", 140 lbs.
I was dx’d also after loosing weight. In fact it was the weight loss which caused me to see the doc in the first place. I was not aware of any other problems. I did not seem to have any of the symptoms that are normaly associated withT2. I was a bit overweight at the time but not excessively for my frame but I was having a lot of pain at the top of my thighs especially when I tried to lie down on my side, which I do when going off to sleep. It became intollerable so I went to the doc thinking it was a flare up of my back problem from which I was just recovering. He examined me and then weighed me. I hadn’t bothered weighing myself for some time so have no idea what I was earlier. At the time I was 96kg’s. The doc thought I was either diabetic or had cancer. Luckily it turned out to be Diabetes. I have insulin resistance and essentially my body was not taking in the food I was eating. It was therefore starving and had started to eat itself. The pain I had was from muscle and tissue loss at the top of my thighs. My bones were almost on the surface. I know for a fact based upon documentation that I was not a diabetic in July 02 and this took place in March 03 so the tissue loss must have taken place over the months inbetween possibly over the eight months. You do not have to be overweight to be a diabetic but there are so many variable factors you cannot say 100% what is a typical diabetic trait. There will always be the exception. We are all different. There are comonalities shared by diabetics but these can only be taken as gross indicators that there might be a problem. They do not necessarily classify someone as a diabetic. I am T2 5′ 11" 174 lbs [and loosing still] 52 and I feel good also. HTH PETE Diagnosed 20/03/03 Type II D&E + Metformin + Gliclazide
Response:
> An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is > the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m > concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though.
You’ll probably continue to feel good. Type 2 diabetes is usually associated with insulin resistance which causes high levels of blood insulin, which in turn usually cause weight gain. Diabetes is a disease of carbohydrate metabolism. Normally, after carbs are eaten, they are converted to glucose and transported by the blood system, ultimately, to all the cells in the body. Insulin is necessary to move the glucose out of the blood stream and into the individual cells. Once inside the cells, glucose is consumed as fuel for energy. Sometimes an undiagnosed diabetic will suddenly find himself making very little insulin. Without insulin, glucose gets blocked up in the blood stream and is not delivered to the cells where it is needed. The cells are literally starving because they have no glucose, even though glucose is very close. As glucose levels mount higher and higher, the kidneys begin filtering out the excessive amounts of blood glucose and passing it out of the body through the urine. So the food you eat is literally urinated away, while your cells remain unfed. Since the cells are not being fed by carbohydrate metabolism, your body turns to fat and protien metabolism for energy. Burning stored fat for energy makes you thinner. These patients are often identified by their complaint that they’re losing weight no matter how much they eat. This is a potentially lethal condition. A byproduct of fat metabolism, ketones, which are normally harmless, can build up to toxic levels in this situation. These people are desperately ill and need treatment. An analogy is sometimes used to illustrate this situation. You’re at home and you’re hungry, so you order groceries. The delivery truck drives up to your home, but there’s no one to unload the truck. So you remain hungry and order more groceries, which arrive but are not unloaded either. This can continue until your driveway is filled with trucks containing groceries, but you remain hungry because no groceries are delivered to you. And because you’re starving, you lose weight. E
Response:
An acquaintance of mine was dx’d T2 after steadily losing weight . What is the connection? Till now, I thought, that all T2 are over-weight. I’m concerned, because I’m very low weight too. I feel good though. Fred Henzi 67, T2 , dx’d 00, 5-10", 140 lbs.
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