Reversing Asthma: Breathe Easier with This Revolutionary New Program
Question:
> I am almost certain that involved the the YOGA method. Buteyko is really > based on Yoga. Well, both recommend slow breathing. One of the actors from > "Law and Order" was involved, Paul S????. I thought that book was out of > print.
Paul Sorvino. I own and have read the book we’re discussing and found it helpul. My take on Buteyko, based on what I read on various web sites and amazon.com reviews, is that it advocates exactly the opposite approach of the one that worked for Mr. Sorvino. Put another way, I found this phrase > Asthmatics over-breathe
on this web page <http://www.buteyko.co.nz/buteyko/work/default.cfm> They seem to advocate taking in less air, while Mr. Sorvino and his doctor advocate training your breathing process to increase the air you take it. I find the idea of getting more air into me a good thing and more oxygen into my bloodstream very appealing. -S- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, > and, just as useless?
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Steve, I am glad to see your post because I have always wondered. Both methods are slower breathing, but the Yoga method is deeper breathing while Buteyko is shallow. So do you think it is the slower breathing itself? You find people who will swear by both methods, so I have been curious about that.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I am almost certain that involved the the YOGA method. Buteyko is really > based on Yoga. Well, both recommend slow breathing. One of the actors from > "Law and Order" was involved, Paul S????. I thought that book was out of > print. > Paul Sorvino. I own and have read the book we’re discussing and found > it helpul. My take on Buteyko, based on what I read on various web > sites and amazon.com reviews, is that it advocates exactly the opposite > approach of the one that worked for Mr. Sorvino. > Put another way, I found this phrase > Asthmatics over-breathe > on this web page > <http://www.buteyko.co.nz/buteyko/work/default.cfm> > They seem to advocate taking in less air, while Mr. Sorvino and his > doctor advocate training your breathing process to increase the air you > take it. I find the idea of getting more air into me a good thing and > more oxygen into my bloodstream very appealing. > -S- > > Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, > > and, just as useless?
Response:
There are certain advanced yoga breathing methods that involve shallow breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. There are similar Chi Kung exercises. After training with Buteyko, I feel that it results in one becoming used to using less oxygen and taking in less air. This would lessen panic, but I wonder if it might also lessen the asthma sufferer’s awareness of his actual breathing capacity, resulting in less warning of an attack. That would obviously be bad. Other negative results have been previously discussed, there is no need for me to rehash them. My personal feeling is that the Buteyko method is not for me. I don’t believe that it actually improves asthma, and until I read differently on Medscape or in the New England Journal, I will continue in that belief. Regards,
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> breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise.
What on God’s green earth does any of this mean? Larry
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> > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > What on God’s green earth does any of this mean? > Larry
I can’t comment on the hormones and enzymes part, but there is an interesting yoga breathing exercise called the vacuum where you exhale, then keeping your breath out, you stand up very tall and lift your rib cage – the kind of things you’d do when taking in a deep breath – but you still don’t breath in. This creates something of a vacuum inside you and causes at least some of your internal organs to rise. It’s supposed to be a good thing and, if it didn’t make me cough, I’d do it more often <asthma, sigh>. -S-
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The question then is does the Sorvino/Firshein method involve deep breathing. My impression was that it did although I haven’t read the book myself.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> There are certain advanced yoga breathing methods that involve shallow > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > There are similar Chi Kung exercises. > After training with Buteyko, I feel that it results in one becoming > used to using less oxygen and taking in less air. This would lessen > panic, but I wonder if it might also lessen the asthma sufferer’s > awareness of his actual breathing capacity, resulting in less warning > of an attack. That would obviously be bad. Other negative results > have been previously discussed, there > is no need for me to rehash them. > My personal feeling is that the Buteyko method is not for me. I don’t > believe that it actually improves asthma, and until I read differently > on Medscape or in the New England Journal, I will continue in that > belief. > Regards,
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> There are certain advanced yoga breathing methods that involve shallow > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > There are similar Chi Kung exercises.
Ah, yes–I am quite familiar with this concept. I knew a girl in college who spent her entire academic career having her internal organs displaced, and I can assure you that she was capable of producing more hormones than otherwise.
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>Ah, yes–I am quite familiar with this concept. I knew a girl in college >who spent her entire academic career having her internal organs displaced, >and I can assure you that she was capable of producing more hormones than >otherwise.
I wonder, perhaps you might have an opinion as to whether the rate of hormone production in this girl was directly proportional to the degree to which her internal organs were displaced? Bob
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>> There are certain advanced yoga breathing methods that involve shallow > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > There are similar Chi Kung exercises. >Ah, yes–I am quite familiar with this concept. I knew a girl in college >who spent her entire academic career having her internal organs displaced, >and I can assure you that she was capable of producing more hormones than >otherwise.
Another thought: This girl that "you knew" in college, did she not also experience episodic hyperventilation, whilst having her internal organs displaced. Also, was she one of the enlightened ones that called out God’s name? Are tonsils considered internal organs? Bob
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> > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > What on God’s green earth does any of this mean? > Larry
Probably: "These diaphragmatic breathing exercises also massage the abdominal organs". Let’s hope the rest is true (and that more enzymes and hormones have a good effect). Regards Richard Friedel
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > What on God’s green earth does any of this mean? > Larry > Probably: "These diaphragmatic breathing exercises also massage the > abdominal organs". Let’s hope the rest is true (and that more enzymes > and hormones have a good effect). Regards Richard Friedel
All diaphragmatic activity "massages" the abdominal organs, as does every motion of the trunk. I would be most interested to know what enzymes and hormones are involved, and of the testing that has shown their production to change as a result of these exercises. Lp
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > breathing. These also involve displacing the internal organs, and > > result in the body producing more hormones and enzymes than otherwise. > What on God’s green earth does any of this mean? > Larry > Probably: "These diaphragmatic breathing exercises also massage the > abdominal organs". Let’s hope the rest is true (and that more enzymes > and hormones have a good effect). Regards Richard Friedel
Well said – all we have is hope. It is not at all clear that diaphragmatic breathing produces more "massaging action" than just walking about, bending, stooping, etc (and I assume that it doesn’t). It is also not clear that more massaging would produce more hormones and enzymes or that this would be beneficial. There is no evidence; either in experiment, observation, or logic; to presume for or against any of it. I guess hope springs eternal in some circles. — CBI, MD
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>Well said – all we have is hope. >I guess hope springs eternal in some circles.
Gee Chris, this is encouraging. I’m reminded of Sheldon Einstein Jr.’s father’s words: "There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle." ""The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed." -Albert Einstein Bob
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> I’m reminded of Sheldon Einstein Jr.’s father’s words: > "There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing > is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
"There are two types of people in this world. Those who divide everyone into two groups and those who don’t." – I forget who — CBI, MD
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While there are obviously no miracle cures about for asthma, it’s worth repeating that sufferers who improve their general fitness may well feel much better. IMHO yoga, like walking, is a good, gentle form of exercise for people who have been sedentary and want to shape up, gradually. I recommend _Richard Hittleman’s Yoga: 28 Day Exercise Plan_, which starts out with very easy exercises that absolutely anyone can do, and progresses to rather difficult exercises that only the most limber can perform. The 28-day nature of the plan helps to emphasize that it is sticking with exercises and performing them regularly that makes a difference in the long-term. — (650) 236-2231 [daytime] http://www.wsrcc.com/alison/ There are important differences between Milosevic and Sharon. For example, Sharon has better hair.
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> While there are obviously no miracle cures about for asthma, it’s > worth repeating that sufferers who improve their general fitness may > well feel much better.
I agree and did not mean to disparage yoga in general. I was just objecting to specific claims that specific exercises will have specific biologic effects. — CBI, MD
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> > While there are obviously no miracle cures about for asthma, it’s > worth repeating that sufferers who improve their general fitness may > well feel much better. > I agree and did not mean to disparage yoga in general. I was just objecting > to specific claims that specific exercises will have specific biologic > effects. > — > CBI, MD
Alternate nostril breathing, nadi sodhana, increases intratracheal suction (negative) pressure. IMT (inspiratory muscle training) does as well. What is the subtle difference? Regards, Richard Friedel
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Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, and, just as useless?
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I am almost certain that involved the the YOGA method. Buteyko is really based on Yoga. Well, both recommend slow breathing. One of the actors from "Law and Order" was involved, Paul S????. I thought that book was out of print.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, > and, just as useless?
Response:
I was browsing, and came across it. The webpage DID look a bit Eastern…<G>
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I am almost certain that involved the the YOGA method. Buteyko is really > based on Yoga. Well, both recommend slow breathing. One of the actors from > "Law and Order" was involved, Paul S????. I thought that book was out of > print. > Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, > and, just as useless?
Response:
>Is this book, by Richard Firshein, just a variation of the Buteyko stuff, >and, just as useless?
Probably, putting ‘cures’ into the popular press avoids the annoying requirement that you demonstrate that they actually work. — "We are fighting today for security, for progress, and for peace, not only for ourselves but for all men, not only for one generation but for all generations. We are fighting to cleanse the world of ancient evils, ancient ills." Franklin Delano Rosevelt State of the Union Address – 1942
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